do i need to use Thermal Grease with a 2.5ghz celeron

[sam unwise]

this is going to be my first home built pc and i don't plan on overclocking.

thanks for any help :)

[Nate Edel]

sam unwise <datrooper@hotmail.com> wrote: this is going to be my first home built pc and i don't plan on overclocking. thanks for any help :)

If you have a retail processor with a fan with integral thermal pad, no, you
don't need thermal grease/heat sink compound. If you have an aftermarket
fan with a thermal pad, I'd consider it an iffy call to use the thermal pad,
but you _can_. If you have an aftermarket fan without a thermal pad, yes,
you need thermal grease/heat sink compound.

The retail fans cool OK even with the stock thermal pad, though it's not a
_bad_ idea to remove it carefully and replace it with thermal grease/heat
sink compound.

--
Nate Edel http://www.nkedel.com/

"Elder Party 2004: Cthulhu for President -- this time WE'RE the lesser
evil."

[Tony Hill]

On 14 Apr 2004 14:18:07 -0700, datrooper@hotmail.com (sam unwise)
wrote:this is going to be my first home built pc and i don't plan on overclocking.thanks for any help :)

Sorry to hear you got a Celeron :(

To answer your question, YES, you definitely do need thermal grease
(or one of those pink thermal pads). Those chips consume a LOT of
power, somewhere up around 60 or 70W of power, so even a small
increase in thermal resistance between your processor and your
heatsink will make a fairly large difference. It probably will work
without the thermal interface material, but there's a strong
probability that it will be running pretty darn hot and possibly even
overheating and going into thermal-protection mode.

I wouldn't be too worried about what brand of thermal grease you get,
any one will do the trick. It might be worthwhile to spend the extra
$2 or so to get some decent quality stuff, especially since one tube
of grease should pretty much cover you for life (1 tube is enough for
25-50 CPUs). On the other hand, don't bother with the $25 "premium"
thermal compound, that stuff is mostly just marketing.

-------------
Tony Hill
hilla <underscore> 20 <at> yahoo <dot> ca

[sam unwise]

thanks for the reply,thankfuly i havent bought a celeron,i was
considering it till i read the reviews in this and other newsgroups :)

sorry to be a bother but could you give me the name of the pink
thermal pads,i hadnt heard of that before and am trying to pick up
things as i go along here :)

Tony Hill <hilla_nospam_20@yahoo.ca> wrote in message news:<901s70tfmplkth5btdtrof8otp3ged1hrd@4ax.com>... On 14 Apr 2004 14:18:07 -0700, datrooper@hotmail.com (sam unwise) wrote:this is going to be my first home built pc and i don't plan on overclocking.thanks for any help :) Sorry to hear you got a Celeron :( To answer your question, YES, you definitely do need thermal grease (or one of those pink thermal pads). Those chips consume a LOT of power, somewhere up around 60 or 70W of power, so even a small increase in thermal resistance between your processor and your heatsink will make a fairly large difference. It probably will work without the thermal interface material, but there's a strong probability that it will be running pretty darn hot and possibly even overheating and going into thermal-protection mode. I wouldn't be too worried about what brand of thermal grease you get, any one will do the trick. It might be worthwhile to spend the extra $2 or so to get some decent quality stuff, especially since one tube of grease should pretty much cover you for life (1 tube is enough for 25-50 CPUs). On the other hand, don't bother with the $25 "premium" thermal compound, that stuff is mostly just marketing. ------------- Tony Hill hilla <underscore> 20 <at> yahoo <dot> ca

[GSV Three Minds in a Can]

Bitstring <58798d39.0404151621.3430dbab@posting.google.com>, from the
wonderful person sam unwise <datrooper@hotmail.com> saidthanks for the reply,thankfuly i havent bought a celeron,i wasconsidering it till i read the reviews in this and other newsgroups :)sorry to be a bother but could you give me the name of the pinkthermal pads,i hadnt heard of that before and am trying to pick upthings as i go along here :)

The Akasa/ShinEtsu ones are reasonably well rated .. see for instance
http://www.extremecooling.co.uk/s/product?product=601089

However if you buy a heatsink/fan, most of them come with a thermal pad
already attached.

--
GSV Three Minds in a Can
Outgoing Msgs are Turing Tested,and indistinguishable from human typing.

[Mike Tomlinson]

In article <58798d39.0404151621.3430dbab@posting.google.com>, sam unwise
<datrooper@hotmail.com> writes
thanks for the reply,thankfuly i havent bought a celeron,i wasconsidering it till i read the reviews in this and other newsgroups :)

Sensible chap. :)
sorry to be a bother but could you give me the name of the pinkthermal pads,i hadnt heard of that before

It's called phase-change material. It looks like a thin square pad of
white or pink gum and is usually protected by a label which you peel off
before fitting the heatsink to the CPU. When the CPU heats up, the
stuff melts and flows into the microscopic gaps between the CPU core and
the heatsink base. The good thing about it is that it doesn't tend to
dry out like the greases you get in a tube, but if you remove the
heatsink for any reason it's best to clean off the phase-change material
(as it's one use only) and replace it with thermal grease.

Chomerics is one manufacturer of the stuff.

--
A. Top posters.
Q. What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?

[Tony Hill]

On 15 Apr 2004 17:21:16 -0700, datrooper@hotmail.com (sam unwise)
wrote:thanks for the reply,thankfuly i havent bought a celeron,i wasconsidering it till i read the reviews in this and other newsgroups :)

Good call!
sorry to be a bother but could you give me the name of the pinkthermal pads,i hadnt heard of that before and am trying to pick upthings as i go along here :)

Hmm... I'm not sure that they really have a name! I suppose they
probably aren't always pink either, though all the ones I've seen have
been. They are usually just referred to as a "thermal transfer pad"
or some such thing. I've never seen them sold separately from a
heatsink in any stores, usually they just come pre-packaged with a
heatsink, particularly if you buy a "retail box" processor which has
the processor and heatsink in one package.

Generally speaking they seem to be falling out of favor. Even most
retail box CPU + heatsink combos seem to come with a little dab of
thermal grease these days. Thermal grease is generally a bit more
effective, but the pads used to be reasonable common because they're
easier to use correctly for new users (thermal grease is only
effective if you use a VERY flat and thin layer, many people just slap
a bunch of the stuff on, sometimes making it worse than no grease at
all). The only reason why I mentioned them is that you don't need to
go out of your way to buy thermal grease if you buy a CPU + heatsink
combo that comes with one of these pads.

-------------
Tony Hill
hilla <underscore> 20 <at> yahoo <dot> ca

[The little lost angel]

On Sat, 17 Apr 2004 17:58:33 -0400, Tony Hill
<hilla_nospam_20@yahoo.ca> wrote:
Hmm... I'm not sure that they really have a name! I suppose theyprobably aren't always pink either, though all the ones I've seen havebeen. They are usually just referred to as a "thermal transfer pad"

Definitely not always pink :P On at least a couple of heatsinks I've
seen, it's been black gum.
easier to use correctly for new users (thermal grease is onlyeffective if you use a VERY flat and thin layer, many people just slapa bunch of the stuff on, sometimes making it worse than no grease atall). The only reason why I mentioned them is that you don't need to

Do we have to go through this again? :P
Only if you're using one of those expensive grease (which aren't
bundled with default HSF anyway) which are thick and not exactly
liquid that you need to worry about too much. Otherwise, excess stuff
are always going to be squeezed right out by the clip pressure. Better
more than not enuff :P

--
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[George Macdonald]

On Sat, 17 Apr 2004 17:58:33 -0400, Tony Hill <hilla_nospam_20@yahoo.ca>
wrote:
On 15 Apr 2004 17:21:16 -0700, datrooper@hotmail.com (sam unwise)wrote:thanks for the reply,thankfuly i havent bought a celeron,i wasconsidering it till i read the reviews in this and other newsgroups :)Good call!sorry to be a bother but could you give me the name of the pinkthermal pads,i hadnt heard of that before and am trying to pick upthings as i go along here :)Hmm... I'm not sure that they really have a name! I suppose theyprobably aren't always pink either, though all the ones I've seen havebeen. They are usually just referred to as a "thermal transfer pad"or some such thing. I've never seen them sold separately from aheatsink in any stores, usually they just come pre-packaged with aheatsink, particularly if you buy a "retail box" processor which hasthe processor and heatsink in one package.

A while back -- K6 & P5 era -- I saw pink pads which had a rubbery feel to
them and they did not work very well. Analyses of performance usually
showed that they only worked at extreme pressures and never as well as
thermal paste - it was my impression that they were really designed for
convenient factory assembly where things got bolted together, e.g. voltage
regulators and power transistors.
Generally speaking they seem to be falling out of favor. Even mostretail box CPU + heatsink combos seem to come with a little dab ofthermal grease these days. Thermal grease is generally a bit moreeffective, but the pads used to be reasonable common because they'reeasier to use correctly for new users (thermal grease is onlyeffective if you use a VERY flat and thin layer, many people just slapa bunch of the stuff on, sometimes making it worse than no grease atall). The only reason why I mentioned them is that you don't need togo out of your way to buy thermal grease if you buy a CPU + heatsinkcombo that comes with one of these pads.

Some of the retail and aftermarket CPU heatsinks I've seen fairly recently
have what looks and feels like a thick paste but is in fact a phase change
material - with heat, it first becomes more fluid, spreads under the
pressure and then hardens into something that feels like plastic.
Obviously this is a one shot deal so if you ever have to take the heatsink
off, you have to scrape the stuff off and apply fresh thermal paste... so
it's always a good idea to keep some thermal paste around.

I'll add that I've seen quite a difference in "quality" between the usual
white thermal pastes. The Radio Shack stuff is awful, the liquid carrier
evaporates/disperses quite quickly and leaves just white powder behind;
stuff I bought at an electronic parts store, don't recall the brand but it
came in quite a largish tube (enough for several lifetimes of hobbyist use)
was much better. With it, a heatsink I took off recently which had been on
for 4 years or so still had enough liquid/grease present that the CPU still
slid around a on it. My first thought was that I'd applied too much back
then but no, there was just a very thin layer of what was still paste.

Rgds, George Macdonald

"Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who, me??